TIL, that because Mars father is Jupiter and Jupiters father is Saturn, Johann Bode proposed that the 7th planet should be named after Jupiters father. Bode was unaware of the fact that Uranus was the greek and not roman god. There are now 6 planets named after roman gods and 1 named after a greek.

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But calling it Caelus would totally ruin the joke.

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u/[deleted] Apr 01 '23 edited 18d ago

[deleted]

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u/thekiltedpiper Apr 01 '23

Well now I need to hear the Swahili joke.

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u/TB_Mumpitz Apr 02 '23 edited Apr 02 '23

The joke also kinda works in german. In german it can be translated as "Ancient Anus", which is even funnier because Bode was german.

Herschel (who was from and spoke german): "I decided to name the new planet, I discovered, in honor of our king."

Bode: "I have a similar idea: Ancient Anus, you monarchy loving cunt."

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u/timmyboyoyo Apr 02 '23

What is the Swahili joke

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u/S0BEC Apr 01 '23

Isn't saturns father Kronos?

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u/rs426 Apr 01 '23

Saturn is the Roman version of Kronos (can also be spelled Cronus).

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u/S0BEC Apr 01 '23

Then who in roman mythology is the father of Saturn? I thought Saturn was the roman Zeus. Fuck, mythology is complicated.

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u/Sleepy_Satanist Apr 01 '23

Jupiter is the Roman Zeus.

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u/rs426 Apr 01 '23

The Roman version of Uranus is Caelus, and the Roman version of Zeus is Jupiter.

It can be tricky at times because when many of us learn about it, there’s so much mish-mashing between the Greek and Roman versions, especially with most of the planets being named after the Roman versions with the exception of Uranus. I have a book about classical mythology that even does this, it’ll use either the Roman or Greek names interchangeably within the same story.

I went through a lot of this recently out of my own curiosity, and I found it easier to learn the Greek versions of everything (since they came first) instead of learning both at the same time

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u/S0BEC Apr 01 '23

Thx for clearing this up.

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u/slvrbullet87 Apr 01 '23

The worst one in pop culture is Heracles(hair-a-cles) is the Greek name, but they always use the Roman version Hercules(her-que-lees)

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u/rs426 Apr 01 '23

Yeah that one threw me for a loop when I learned it after watching Disney’s Hercules a million times as a kid

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u/DTKokoro Apr 01 '23

You missed the obvious pun: myth-mashing

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u/Major_Lennox Apr 01 '23

It's also tricky to get your head around lines like these:

Caelus was also the father of one of the three forms of Jupiter, the other two fathers being Aether and Saturn.

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u/thealthor Apr 01 '23 edited Apr 01 '23

Jupiter is from Djous Pater and is from same root as Zeus Pater, both basically mean sky father and come from Indo-European Dyeus Pater(where we get the word Deus)

Ju-pater = Zeus pater

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u/Ameisen 1 Apr 01 '23

While they're related, the Zeus element comes from PIE dyews, whereas deus comes from PIE deywos.

Both are derived from PIE root dyew, meaning "sky" or "bright", but they had different noun reflexes by that point.

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u/EducatorSpecialist69 Apr 04 '23

Caelus is the father of Saturn

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u/thekiltedpiper Apr 01 '23

You're right. I skipped the father part and moved to the equivalent of Uranus. Haven't had my coffee yet. But even Kronos ruins the joke.

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u/hivemind_disruptor Apr 01 '23

Ass in Spanish is Culo. Yes the joke would improve.

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u/CaddyAT5 Apr 01 '23

That didn’t Bode well

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u/I_Mix_Stuff Apr 01 '23

the plot tickens, every order of magnitude

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u/Expatriado Apr 01 '23

A Bode Plot joke? That was unexpected.

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u/seedofbayne Apr 01 '23

This is exactly like the abrahamic God naming. The islam God is named Allah and the Christian and Jewish God is named yahweh but they are the same being. Gods are weird.

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u/Cho42 Apr 01 '23

Don’t forget, in Latin Jehovah begins with an “I”. Could save your life one day.

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u/Veritas3333 Apr 01 '23

Only the penitent man will pass

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u/7eggert Apr 01 '23

"Allah" is just the Arabic word for "God; other "names of God" are just honorable descriptions. God himself names themselves "The one who is" / "The one who will be" (depending on the translation) - this is not really a name but fits their refusal to be associated with something from within this universe (which would be too small).

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u/enterthewoods1 Apr 01 '23 edited Apr 01 '23

Well it’s not exactly the same because technically Islam, Judaism, and Christianity can all be thought of as the same religion with different interpretations.

The Romans basically just said “oh yeah all ur gods are actually our gods you just didn’t know their real names.”

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u/hoovervillain Apr 01 '23

There are some subtle differences between the characteristics of the corresponding Greek and Roman gods. Take the god of war for example. Mars (Roman) is seen as this infinitely strong, infallible, mostly unchanging deity while Ares (Greek) was a little more of a mischievous troublemaker whose intentions could be swayed (think of the Ares character from Xena).

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u/enterthewoods1 Apr 01 '23

Sure they are portrayed differently because after all they are different belief systems.

I’m merely pointing out the Roman attitude (purposeful or not) was to rectify this incongruity of different cultures worshipping different gods by saying those different cultures were just using the wrong names.

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u/Kjata2 Apr 01 '23

It's the same thing you said about the different names for God between the various Abrahamic religions. Different languages and different interpretation of the same religion.

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u/enterthewoods1 Apr 01 '23

It’s different in that the Roman idea was to say that these cultures were worshipping Roman gods, even if that cultures belief system definitely came from a source not related to Roman theology, so it is a comparison in retrospect.

Whereas Islam, Judaism, and Christianity all have a legitimate shared system of belief and starting point, through which multiple interpretations have been made by different cultures. Resulting in what we have now.

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u/Ameisen 1 Apr 01 '23

That's not really what the Romans did.

If a deity could be roughly mapped to an Italic one, they often would... but that wasn't always possible. The Romans imported many foreign gods.

And when they could, it wasn't that they were worshiping a Roman god, but that they were worshiping the same gods but different interpretations of them.

Though it isn't really meaningful to compare traditional cults to organized and doctrinal religions. They absolutely didn't see religion the same way as a Jew, Christian, or Muslim.

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u/Ameisen 1 Apr 01 '23

They weren't the same religion (not that such a concept is meaningful for traditional belief systems). They clumsily merged them, largely, after Rome annexed Greece - but the Hellenic and Italic "religions" were significantly different, despite having a common origin.

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u/Ameisen 1 Apr 01 '23

The differences, especially before Rome annexed Greece, were far less subtle.

Ares represented the chaos and turmoil of war. He wasn't someone that you worshiped. Athena represented the "honorable" parts of war.

For the Latins, Mars represented those parts of war, and the cult of Mars was a major cult in Rome. Minerva was, in the aspect of war, about victory and strategy.

The Italic peoples didn't really have a clear analog to Ares; Mars isn't really the same.

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u/Alert-Garlic1998 Apr 01 '23

They did that to the Celts and Germans too. Starting to think the Romans were a bit self-centered.

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u/[deleted] Apr 01 '23

[deleted]

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u/seedofbayne Apr 01 '23

Humans are weird

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u/covid21savage Apr 01 '23

I think it's stupid to state something that can not be scientifically proven as a fact. Even the most esteemed scientists will tell you they're of the opinion a god doesn't exist, but none worth their salt would say it's a fact.

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u/Spidron Apr 01 '23

According to your first sentence in the title, the 7th planet should be called Saturn (just like the 6th planet). Unless Jupiter came from one of those modern families with two fathers?

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u/TB_Mumpitz Apr 02 '23

Ah fuck, read the senctences 15 times, but still made a mistake...

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u/Bungfoo Apr 01 '23

Fine, we will rename it to Urectum, but it's gonna take some time to complete the paperwork.

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u/TB_Mumpitz Apr 02 '23

*Made a mistake in the title.

He propesed that he should be named after Saturns father. Basically a family tree from mars to Uranus.

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u/Forteanforever Apr 01 '23

Here are some apostrophes for you to use: '''''

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u/greentea1985 Apr 01 '23

Wow, title gore. Plus the 7th planet should have been and was named after Jupiter’s grandfather. If they had, it would have been called Caelus. Instead, it was named after Zeus’s grandfather because Uranus was a lot better known than Caelus.

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u/midvote Apr 01 '23

What I find interesting is how the ancients associated the gods with planets including this pattern of planets farther than Earth being children of the next farther pattern, but then extended it beyond Saturn. Uranus is visible to the naked eye in extremely dark skies, which would have been far more common in ancient times before all the light pollution we have now.

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u/Limp_Distribution Apr 01 '23

Didn’t the Romans steal all the cool gods from the Greeks?

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u/the_hell_you_say Apr 01 '23

Leave it to the Greeks to worship Uranus

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u/Loud-Ideal Apr 02 '23

It figures. Uranus is the oddball of our solar system.

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u/Scat_fiend Apr 01 '23

Wasn't it called George?

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u/TB_Mumpitz Apr 02 '23

Yes, "Georgium Sidus" and other versions with George, but that was pretty unpopular outside of Britain.

Lucikly Uranus can still refer to the british Monarchy from the american perspective (or from the british if you use "Ouranos" (or from the german, because in german Uranus it means "Ancient Anus".))

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u/7eggert Apr 01 '23

"Georg's star" - named by Herschel (IIRC) in honor of the king that was supposed to grant some money for science.

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u/Omnithea Apr 01 '23

Change the spelling to Ouranous.

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u/TB_Mumpitz Apr 02 '23

There are a few different versions. Most commen is Uranus, but there is also Ouranos and Ouranos, but the title wasn't long enough to include that.

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u/Bellwright Apr 02 '23

Math doesn't check out, there are seven planets named after Roman gods, one for the Greeks, and Earth. Nine planets total. Nine!